Who in their right mind would do this?

[predinburgh]

Having built my own website in the Drupal cms system I know how difficult this is for non-web folk. I'm very happy with the results now but what a mountain I've climbed to get here! I had help with it in the end that I couldn't have done without. My talents lie in journalism and PR here in Edinburgh, not web design I duly discovered (but secretly already knew).


My query is this -

Who else in their right mind would have a go at building their own website? Would or have you? What did you discover?
--------------------------

The 'object' of which caused many sleepless nights and much hand-ringing (maybe that's a bit OTT - i'm a perfectionist you see) can be observed here
PR Pigeon - Edinburgh | Public Relations in Edinburgh

PS. I did it because I could:thumbup1:

 

[Mike Lewis]

My query is this -

Who else in their right mind would have a go at building their own website?

Me, for one. Although whether I qualify as being in my right mind is debatable.

Your website looks good to me. I'm sure it was a lot of effort, but you can feel justifiably pleased with the results.

Mike

 

[predinburgh]

Somebody feel free to move this post. I do believe it might be in the wrong place!

Thanks for your compliments. Yes, I am rather pleased with my site. I wish I'd been armed with more knowledge before I started building it though.

Thing is, I didn't know the questions to ask or indeed who to ask without getting the hard sell so I forged ahead alone.

If I knew then what I know now I'd have done things differently.

 

[Scottish Business Owner]

Somebody feel free to move this post. I do believe it might be in the wrong place!.

I've moved this!

I have to agree with Mike I think the site is great I dont envy that learning curve though having had my own experiences of Joomla which isn't even as complicated as Drupal (Isn't Ecademy built on Drupal?).

I've tried and failed a few times with websites to the extent now that I have people involved in the various aspects of any site I take live. Things like forums also need a bit more so as well as design you have to have people in the background keeping it up to date and secure.

Things like Wordpress do help a little and I use this on a few sites but I still needed design help and help with tweaking it to what I wanted. They also need kept up to date and secure. I'll never go back to doing this all myself because it just causes stress and anxiety and it's a total false economy.

 

[Canary Dwarf]

Hi Jill

I commend you for having a go, but I have a question: if you found it so difficult, how are you able to offer it as a service to your clients ('Web design that creates easy-to-use, tailored sites')

Drupal is hard for a beginner to master, so you've done a good job getting it all together.

Constructively, i'll add that it's not immediately apparent what connection the lemon and it's coloured segments has with PR. Maybe all you need is a legend such as, 'Fresh ideas. With colourful copy'

The type is a little on the small side, particularly the bottom half of the page.
Not convinced the colours work well together, blue and cyan.

Well done though for sticking it out. I gave up on Drupal years ago.

 

[predinburgh]

We have a great web developer on board who is an absolute whizz. He does the functionality and design on client sites.

This post is intended for people to share their experiences on their initial steps of having a go at their own websites. My story of where my site began is an integral part of the journey.


My tagline is in the pipeline!

 

[Former Member 1]

I put my first site online in about '94-'95. And to be honest, thought it's evolved over the years, I don't think my skills have moved much further forward... What I discovered was that the whilst project management skills, and many of the process and production skills I had as a video producer were transferable, the actual medium itself bored me.

By that I mean that whilst I could engage with the technicalities, and cope with them, it was a chore and very quickly became apparent that the actual coding and management of websites was, ultimately a trade in itself. To gain the same level of competence as I had in my native medium would take a similar level of study and application.

Later on, I found myself teaching media law and project management to computing students in the context of web and multimedia design. And it became obvious that there was a matching skills gap on their part; the result of them 'til that point only being focussed on the technical aspects of their craft.

Having come 'through the ranks' from the technical side of TV production I could empathise. But then I'd grown through a relatively mature medium that itself had grown out of another (cinema). I'd had the advantage that the mere novelty of being able to produce pictures on a screen had never been enough to survive.

What I discovered was what I already knew... Whilst we have a more or less 'common currency' in the form of the project management processes that allow us to create effective (and importantly legally safe!) media products, there are always limitations that only proper training and experience can overcome...

At best those that aren't prepared to make that journey can only get so far... Far enough maybe to meet some basic needs. Unfortunately a little knowledge really IS a very dangerous thing, and the other thing I discovered is that too many people don't realise that...

 

[NealeGilhooley]

Hi Jill

I also commend your efforts. We design and build websites and then train Client how to update them but we do warn them that using software like Contribute does not make them web designers. Teaching them any more seems like a lot of work plus at the start of a new business most just don’t have the time and they are best to pay Pro’s to do a Pro job. I think it is different in your case but most companies would be best advised to put their efforts into area’s that will generate significant revenue for their business.

 

[HostThree]

I've worked with a few clients who have attempted it, a lot of the problem comes from not knowing what tools you actually need to make a website.

Saying that though, when I done some web design stuff at University the majority of "web design lectures" didn't have a clue!

P.S You done a cracking job on your site, it looks really good

 

[Former Member 1]

Saying that though, when I done some web design stuff at University the majority of "web design lectures" didn't have a clue!

Neatly blowing any promotion prospects oot the watter...

The computing mob tend to have too many code monkeys who are weak on design and project management. Art and Design think anything with a 13A plug on it is the work of the Devil and must be burned with fire and think managing a project is all about choosing Garamond over BodiniMT Black for the front cover. And business studies are too busy extrapoliating fully rounded interpolational strategies to facilitate cross mediational fiscal expansion with exit strategies that miniminse trans enclosure displacement of monetary resources during trans osophogeal induction of alcoholic substances.....

:001_tt2::001_tt2:

And none of them talk to each other....

You need to realise that Uni is all about the comedy value... They've too much of a bad habit of drawing staff directly from the former student body; All theory and no industrial experience...

We quite often get graduates coming back to do an HND in a different but related discipline and they're usually shocked when we start actually teaching them practical design and business skills as part of the core activity...

 

[HostThree]

Neatly blowing any promotion prospects oot the watter...

The computing mob tend to have too many code monkeys who are weak on design and project management. Art and Design think anything with a 13A plug on it is the work of the Devil and must be burned with fire and think managing a project is all about choosing Garamond over BodiniMT Black for the front cover. And business studies are too busy extrapoliating fully rounded interpolational strategies to facilitate cross mediational fiscal expansion with exit strategies that miniminse trans enclosure displacement of monetary resources during trans osophogeal induction of alcoholic substances.....

:001_tt2::001_tt2:

And none of them talk to each other....

You need to realise that Uni is all about the comedy value... They've too much of a bad habit of drawing staff directly from the former student body; All theory and no industrial experience...

We quite often get graduates coming back to do an HND in a different but related discipline and they're usually shocked when we start actually teaching them practical design and business skills as part of the core activity...

Looks like I've just dug my own grave :scared: lol

Yeh you are right, this guy had been a primary school teacher previously so had no experience at all. His designs were just dreadful, he kept stealing all of his content and images from other designers the majority of his notes were from the American Universities also.

 

[Former Member 1]

Looks like I've just dug my own grave :scared: lol

Nawww mate... Just hand me the shovel and I'll help you tidy the corners up... :lol:

Yeh you are right, this guy had been a primary school teacher previously so had no experience at all. His designs were just dreadful, he kept stealing all of his content and images from other designers the majority of his notes were from the American Universities also.

It drives me nuts that sort of thing... I'm lucky in that the department I'm in was only set up a few years back. And the guy that set it up went WAYYYY around the houses to source people that were active in industry and had a strong track record... But then we're specialising in this sort of thing...

A big problem is that rather than pass parts of a course out to other department as 'service' units there's an (understandable) temptaion to keep these things in-house... Because it means teaching hours and staff that might have key strengths in other areas retained.. BUT! The result is often what you've expereinced! It's not good! And it's a hard call to make. Because sometimes you get units that theoretically might sit better as service units but actually require a more specialised approach....

Your best bet (if you're a bloke) is just to hang out in the Art Department... You won't learn any less, the largely female populus are at least beguilling company and if you've a cruel streak (as I have) it's great fun finding the crustiest most set-in-his-ways male art teacher and disassembling Gothe's colour theory as physical nonsense...:laugh::laugh::laugh:

 

[predinburgh]

Thanks for all your thoughts and compliments folks :001_smile:

John Taylor who does the web events at the Business Gateway reckons he's never seen a person who can do all aspects of a website: functionality, design and copywriting. I managed the copywriting (I'm a qualified journalist and PR professional) some of the functionality but the crisp way it now looks is down to my great web guy - anybody can contact him through my site.

Does anybody know people who are adept at all three - functionality, design and copywriting - without having to call in extra help?

Are they a rare breed?

 

[Former Member 1]

John Taylor who does the web events at the Business Gateway reckons he's never seen a person who can do all aspects of a website: functionality, design and copywriting.

He's absolutely bang-on-the-money there... And that cuts across all aspects of generating content. A team of experts is one thing, a clutch of blaggers is another...And Jack of All Trades is a cliche; but no less true for that fact.

I HOPE we're seeing the beginning of the end as far as the 'moonlighting' culture is concerned. People need to stick to their own specialisms and co-operate with other specialist rather than trying to undercut them or ape them... To do otherwise other is self anihilating to the extent that it drives down quality; erodes the availability of genuine expertise and ultimately devalues the end-product to the point where it can cease to be viable commercially.

And that can reach a point where it places the client or end user at risk...

 

[Dizzydiza]

Ok coming in here again with the cows tail.....late... as my brides are on their wedding day! If that is your first attempt at websites then wow. If you want to see amateur website building go visit the stuff I have done.
Church
Tiara
Flowers
Its listed in the order I created them and as you can see my skills have not really improved....lol

 

[Former Member 1]

Ok coming in here again with the cows tail.....late... as my brides are on their wedding day! If that is your first attempt at websites then wow. If you want to see amateur website building go visit the stuff I have done.
Church
Tiara
Flowers
Its listed in the order I created them and as you can see my skills have not really improved....lol

For what it is Di there's nothing wrong with what you've done so please don't think I'm having a pop at you or anyone else. Your skills probably have improved... Certainly your Tiarra site is far better than the church site.. And at least all the photos and copy on the sites are your own. What Jill's ahowing us here though is a site designed to meet a need within a firm of full tim professinals targeting the B2B sector at a fairly well-developed level. The Design is good, message is strong, it's very navigable...

But Jill, as she said, is a trained journalist and PR pro... So she'll have a keen eye for (if not actually the ability to execute) design, content and the project management skills to pull this together and... She had the sense to get help where help was needed. And the rub comes when you look at the team behind it... Three serious, strong professionals; and they're not mucking about, what you're getting here are specialists. Just axactly as it should be....

Does anybody know people who are adept at all three - functionality, design and copywriting - without having to call in extra help?

Holy rhetorical question batman! :laugh::laugh:

We know, of course, of many who make claims to all these abilities and more. My own view on the 'Jack of all trades' types is well known. If you see someone offering to do 'anything and everything' that's probably because they're not particularly skilled at anything. And are using this 'scatter gun' effect in a desperate attempt to pick up what stray work they can...

Legitimate creative professionals tend to be specialist... We have a common currency in the shape of the project management skills we're taught at college. And certainly some degree of multi-skilling is possible. But with each individual trade taking years, and thousands of hours of study to master to get to a commercial level... It's simply not possible for one person to 'know it all'.

That is simply a myth put about by people who sell software, books and micky-mouse web design courses... (And their clients!)

And I think the business-public (and indeed the public at large) need to be educated in the fact that there are serious dangers in both the DIY approach and in trying to cut corners by buying on price alone. At one end there's the sort of visual assault that is un-navigable and simply drives people away...

LEE'S CAMERAS (HOLBORN) LTD. Specialists in Cine, Audio Visual & Photographic Equipment

At the other there's the more typical and serious danger that the web designer's lack of professional skill and integrity could cost you very dear indeed...

As this sorry tale relates...

The real cost of being sued by Getty | Copyright Action

Who, in their right mind would build a DIY business website? Should that not be rephrased to who, knowing all the dangers and pitfalls and implications would build a DIY business website? ..No-one!

But then very few who try it appreciate all the dangers and pitfalls and implications... And indeed quite a few who set up in business doing it for others don't appreciate them either! :scared: